RachandLiam Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Kaiser is bloodline zero, which..although we dont know much of, (there isnt much on the net). We know he is fast and of smaller structure...(Again if anybody can shed some more light on this, that would brilliant)!! ------BREEDER RUNS THEM OFTEN THIS IS ALL I KNOW SO FAR AND THIS IS FROM A POST ON THIS SITE. The Zero bloodline, I believe, was developed in the late 1970s or early 1980s by Harris Dunlap out of Bakers Mills, New York. Much of the information on this topic was on sites related to the Seppala Sled Dogs. Unfortunately, most of those sites have been shutdown recently. It seems the effort to maintain or replicate the Seppala bloodline became too diverse and took several directions. But I digress. Harris Dunlap was one of the few who developed a team of Siberians that raced in open competition and were extremely fast. He started racing in the 1960s with Siberians, but later switched to Alaskan Huskies, but still bred Siberians. It is Siberians that are traced back to Harris Dunlap's line that are referred to as Zero Bloodline Siberians. The reason that the BSHRA will disqualify dogs from this line, is because they believe a dog within a certain number of generations will be genetically predisposed to be better at speed running than a dog that does not have the Zero Bloodline in its pedigree. Dunlap was an active breeder from the early 1960s up until about 1990. Zero Bloodline Huskies were developed out of Igloo Pak, Calivali, Seeley, and Seppala Bloodlines. He also used some Canadian lines in developing the Zero Bloodline. Does a Zero Bloodline Siberian look any different than a non-Zero Bloodline Siberian? Some say no, others say yes. There was some thought that Harris actually introduced another breed into the mix to get the results he wanted. Many suspect this other breed was the Alaskan Husky (which is a mixed breed containing Siberian Husky), which he also bred. Zero Bloodline Huskies most often have very short hair and minimal undercoat. The controversy of the Zero Bloodline seems to be more active in Europe than in the US where Harris Dunlap exported some of his dogs. Just so you know, I did not know any of this until today, and gleaned it from researching the Internet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Do they look different to other Siberians - IMO yes all the Zero's i've met have been smaller and their coats thinner - never yet seen a full coated zero sibe. they are banned from bshra but can race through shcgb i believe although someone will correct me if i'm wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachandLiam Posted January 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Thanks for this... He is 10 kg at 11wk...is this normal? we do not overfeed and stools are solid. He is gorgeous, and very active and friendlier than anyones best friend. To be honest he looks no different to any other sibe that age. Vets said he is perfectly healthy his weight is perfect and he is spot on. (but was a total w*$nker ant the same time giving us the 'hard sell' gold plan pitch just after his second jab, ....(all we wanted was sound advice)We currently have the 4 week free insurance with KC, but we need to change... I think?? Whats the best pet insurance...please help! Can you give me some advice though please... Cheers me dears xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snssewell Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Now I wonder. How would I find out if I have a bloodline zero Husky? I do have her pedigree would it be on there? Just wondering because at 7 month she still has not much of an undercoat and she sure can run FAST and she is not very big compared to other Husky's! I always call her a midget . Just wondering since I seen this post. It would explain a lot. Of course she could just be a short coat, fast, midget husky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachandLiam Posted January 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 hey.. .thanks for the post back, our breeder kadexek has the van lettered, and s the best...really good breeder we picked her before our pup was even born. there was no reason for her to to do this but she advertised her pups as 'bloodline zero'. we of course asked questions and got some answers but OUr Kais is lovely not skinny at all, gorgeous... his mum and dad can be seen at mum http://www.kadexek.co.uk/#/the-kadexek-females/4538565157 shona dad http://www.kadexek.co.uk/#/the-kadexek-males/4538391413 merlin kaiser is so fast its unbelievable... i live in fields of land and we have races!! xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachandLiam Posted January 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 its not on the papers btw...its more like a gene bred into them, its dying out from what i can tell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCouture Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 I wondered the same with Embry as his coat is very short, he's little and fast! His dads side a few gnerations back contains TONS of Sepalla lines but I don't know about Zero lines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid_Wolf Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Some kennels are still breeding the zero lines, Neozero is a UK kennel, they dont breed often but many (if not all, im unsure) of their dog have zero in their pedigree's they are not allowed to race with BSHRA if they have Zero in the last 5 generations of their bloodline, but can run with other organisations, such as SHCGB BSHRA believe that they are not purebred, or at least not as 'pure' as sibes of other lines, yet the person who runs BSHRA, also signs their KC registration papers!!!!!!!!!!!! Weird eh?? From what I've seen they're damn good working dogs, very focused Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules dief taz tor Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 taz has zero blood lines , hes all legs lol, certainly wouldnt say he was small, hes the biggest of our three Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutsibe Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Had you found this link? http://siberian-husky-bloodlines.seppalasleddogs.com/zero.htm Sorry. Silke and Jennet, but while some of the same ancestors are likely to be waaaaay in the background, there are probably no Zero dogs in the pedigrees... You could try to research back on the ancestors you find in the last generation of the pedigrees you have and see if you can tract them back further. (If you want to PM me, I can give you either my email or my address, and if you send me a copy of the pedigree, I'll see if I can tell you anything about any of the dogs in it - no guarantees that I will be able to, but I'd try.) Zero bloodlines would most likely appear in the pedigrees of a really serious racing kennel's lines here in the US, and there are several other kennels/lines that also had/have generally shorter coats - many racing kennels prefer a shorter, thinner coat because it allows a dog to cool more efficiently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princessmom Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 "Of course she could just be a short coat, fast, midget husky. " I've got one of those, too. Jennet's Zoey is one of the few dogs she has to run flat out to catch. She hasn't raced Embry yet, I don't think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCouture Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 "Of course she could just be a short coat' date=' fast, midget husky. "[/size'] I've got one of those, too. Jennet's Zoey is one of the few dogs she has to run flat out to catch. She hasn't raced Embry yet, I don't think. Zoey can't even keep up with Embry, he's way too fast for his own good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCouture Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Had you found this link? http://siberian-husk...gs.com/zero.htm Sorry. Silke and Jennet, but while some of the same ancestors are likely to be waaaaay in the background, there are probably no Zero dogs in the pedigrees... You could try to research back on the ancestors you find in the last generation of the pedigrees you have and see if you can tract them back further. (If you want to PM me, I can give you either my email or my address, and if you send me a copy of the pedigree, I'll see if I can tell you anything about any of the dogs in it - no guarantees that I will be able to, but I'd try.) Zero bloodlines would most likely appear in the pedigrees of a really serious racing kennel's lines here in the US, and there are several other kennels/lines that also had/have generally shorter coats - many racing kennels prefer a shorter, thinner coat because it allows a dog to cool more efficiently. i was mistaken Embrys great great great grandmothers were Sepp-Alta, I heard it was similar to the Sepalla lines? I have no idea what Embrys mom's pedigree is because as far as I know she's unregistered with the KC and didn't have any sort of papers. this is Embry's dads brothers pedigree http://pawvillage.com/pedigree/pedigree.asp?ID=OF9RZ3Q4U8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snssewell Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Had you found this link? http://siberian-husk...gs.com/zero.htm Sorry. Silke and Jennet, but while some of the same ancestors are likely to be waaaaay in the background, there are probably no Zero dogs in the pedigrees... You could try to research back on the ancestors you find in the last generation of the pedigrees you have and see if you can tract them back further. (If you want to PM me, I can give you either my email or my address, and if you send me a copy of the pedigree, I'll see if I can tell you anything about any of the dogs in it - no guarantees that I will be able to, but I'd try.) Zero bloodlines would most likely appear in the pedigrees of a really serious racing kennel's lines here in the US, and there are several other kennels/lines that also had/have generally shorter coats - many racing kennels prefer a shorter, thinner coat because it allows a dog to cool more efficiently. That would be cool. I'll PM you. When I first got the pedigree I was googling the names and I found 1 or 2 of the grand parents but that was about it. I just tried again to see if I can find anything but didn't find much. But I am not good at that stuff anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parksy Posted February 20, 2011 Report Share Posted February 20, 2011 Any good breeder will tell you that the dog has zero in the bloodline because you cannot run them with BSHRA so they are quite right to tell you that the dog has this in their bloodline. from looking at the parents the sire is slight build and this is a usual trait of the zero line. Ther will always be debates about the zero line, but if you google the history then you will see that when they were banned they have still not been reinstated. WHY? They never ever done dna tests, they could never prove anything in the 80's and still to this day people [like myself] who have zero dogs are not allowed to run our dogs. When they came over they ran very fast, but the bloodline is diluted now, as it is no doubt with your breeders dogs. However, they are quite right to tell you about the lines. Lines are lines, and the ones you have to worry about are the people who do NOT giver you this informtion! BSRA have never chosen to open up about by they would never give DNA tests to the dogs origionally, and to this day they will still not get into it. People just choose to run with other orgs, or not run with any and just exercise their dogs. As for the k.c insurance, then if you look at the supermarket sites they give you a good deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raindog Posted February 20, 2011 Report Share Posted February 20, 2011 t if you google the history then you will see that when they were banned they have still not been reinstated. WHY? They never ever done dna tests, they could never prove anything in the 80's and still to this day people [like myself] who have zero dogs are not allowed to run our dogs. When they came over they ran very fast, but the bloodline is diluted now, as it is no doubt with your breeders dogs. However, they are quite right to tell you about the lines. Lines are lines, and the ones you have to worry about are the people who do NOT giver you this informtion! BSRA have never chosen to open up about by they would never give DNA tests to the dogs origionally, and to this day they will still not get into it. People just choose to run with other orgs, or not run with any and just exercise their dogs. In the UK, the Zero line was primarily introduced by a guy called Steve Radburn who had imported several dogs from Harris Dunlap's "Zero" kennel into the UK. These included many dogs still seen way back in many pedigrees today - Zero's Brew, Zero's Flutter etc. Steve also bred his own dogs from these Zero lines under his Tupilak affix. When Steve decided to get out of dogs in the mid '90's, he sold them to a guy from the south coast called Neil Marshall. Neil started to train his team and was soon winning everything in sight. Up to that point, BSDRA (as it was in those days) was dominated by one or two people who always came first or second every time they raced. Suddenly this upstart was beating them by miles. That is why they were banned. Quite a lot of us who were active in husky racing at the time wore T Shirts stating "If you can't beat 'em, Ban 'em!" When BSHRA was formed by the former BSDRA people, Zeros were banned and remain so to this day despite no pubilc reason ever having been given. Personally I'm not a lover of Zeros, I prefer my sibes with a bit of body and coat, but I don't believe the ban ever had a factual basis, but was based on jealousy and resentment. Mick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopeak Posted February 20, 2011 Report Share Posted February 20, 2011 It's interesting that every time this bloodline comes up it turns into a BSHRA bashing match and some believe that because they have a dog from a particular line at Great Grand Parent level it is a dog of that line, even though in fact it is actually rather dilute. Sepp-Alta is Doug Willet's kennel, one of the strongest Seppala kennels around. Happy Chatting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopeak Posted February 20, 2011 Report Share Posted February 20, 2011 Hey Mick didn't see your post when I responded, whatever could you be inferring with your last sentiment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parksy Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 This was not a bashing exercise for BSHRA. Each to their own, some like the thinner line, some don't. If the post was read correctly, then it WAS stated that the zero line is indeed diluted as in the above quote. I am not here to bash any org, couldn't care less who has what dog, but as we are all aware until the evidence is proven, and while the K.C secretary is signing the docs zero's are still and always will be huskies. Until the evidence is there in black and white by DNA, and i believe it is too late now to dispute it [correct me if i am wrong] but if BSHRA choose to exclude the line, then so be it, they just go elsewhere to place their cash to run their dogs. But i do understnad what you are saying, in some respects, and in some forums many are more aggresive and abusive when it comes to this line. But when it comes down to it, who gives a ****! Spot on Mick with the last statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidjk Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 is there a pedigree for the zero bloodline. iw ould be really interested to see if micha is zero bloodline, as she runs like a demon, its like she has an extra gear, people often comment " duck me shes fast" She looks thinner in the face than most huskies i have seen. we joke that her father was a fox as she is slim faced. she is very well muscled, with virtually no fat, and with her summer coat she looks like shee needs feeding up even though she is 22KG. suki at 25 kg looks much healthier, but she is husky x mal i would have another micha in a heart beat, she has such intelligence, a real joy for life, and always brings a smile to my face mind you i would have another suki also a real softee everyone can cuddle her. infact send all your huskies to me i love them all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
husky princess Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 mick has previously put some info on here about the zero bloodline. they origionally came over from america. they are very fast and need to be worked. a pet owner would may struggle to satisy their needs based on casual walking etc. Many of the dedicated mushers want zero bloodline. They do seem to have a specific look about them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raindog Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 a pet owner would may struggle to satisy their needs based on casual walking etc. Interestingly, Neil and I used to help each other out getting dogs to the startline at rallies and was always expressing surprise at how powerful my non-zero dogs were. His zeros were relatively easy to walk to the startline. Once they were running though, I wouldn't see his dogs for dust!!! Hi Ewan - how are you doing!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahNukka&Shadow Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 Interestingly, Neil and I used to help each other out getting dogs to the startline at rallies and was always expressing surprise at how powerful my non-zero dogs were. His zeros were relatively easy to walk to the startline. Once they were running though, I wouldn't see his dogs for dust!!! Hi Ewan - how are you doing!! Thats very interesting Mick, perhaps the Zero dogs knew to conserve their energy for the run rather than expending it before the race bouncing and howling? LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidjk Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 . a pet owner would may struggle to satisy their needs based on casual walking etc. i think this is true of all huskies. i can walk mine for 4 h ours and they still want more, and stay awake late at night. but take them out for a 2 hour run on bike or in the woods, and that and a night walk seems to satisfy them. we did take micha out once to an area that mushers use (chobham common), and micha ran for 5 hours (in the snow), stopping for a drink or to sniff once in a while. she goes mad in the snow it seems quality of time out is more important than quantity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raindog Posted February 21, 2011 Report Share Posted February 21, 2011 Thats very interesting Mick, perhaps the Zero dogs knew to conserve their energy for the run rather than expending it before the race bouncing and howling? LOL It wasn't the bouncing and howling, they just weren't as strong. Once they were up to speed though - they were like lightning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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