I'll be hated for this...

[ponder85]

Why do people refuse to physically correct their dogs?

I see dogs like children. Most of us would agree that on some level,

dogs are like kids. I'll be upfront, I'm 27 and do not have kids.

However, when I was little and when I messed up, I got hit. I grew up in a

very loving home, but I knew the rules. If I got too far out of line,

I got hit or spanked. Why the hesitation to do it to a dog?

I have a sibe, and a GSD. When I walk into the house both are all

over me with affection and love. I do a lot with/for my dogs. There's

very little I wouldn't do for them, and they both know it. My sibe

loves to rough house with me. He loves to play and will jerk his head forward and slam

his jaws shut literally a quarter inch from my nose, and I return the

favor by throwing punches that stop a quarter inch from his, and we

both love it. If I can get a hold of him, I'll power bomb him onto the couch, and he runs away and "talks smack" to me (howling). I've accidentally hit him a few times, and I've had my

nose bit as well. I think we both understand. What I'm trying to

illustrate is that we have a great relationship. We play hard, have fun and love each other.

No one who sees me interact with my dogs would come close to saying

either are abused.

However, if they get out of line, they both know they will get hit. If

my gsd nips at me, she gets hit. (yes, I've done all the proper "OWWW!" training; she knows) If my husky goes after the cat, he

gets hit. If I catch them eating people food that got left out, they

both know pain comes next.

They rarely get out of line. I can go away for hours and come home

with the cat being fine, no people food eaten, not get nipped, etc.

My gf doesn't have a problem with how I discipline them. She does not

do it, though. Its night and day between how they respond to the two of us. They'll both run away from her. She can call them and they'll do what they want if they don't feel like coming back. I probably have one of the few huskies on this board who is regularly let off lead. He comes back, immediately. If he doesn't the first time, then he gets my "serious" voice. He knows what comes next. He comes back. I let him off lead in my unfenced front yard daily. Been doing it a year and a half. Never had a single issue.

A couple months back I was at my mom's house for a family gathering. She lives by some woods. Her neighbor's little 15 lb dog ran through mom's yard toward the woods and both of mine went in hot pursuit. A stern yell brought both to a screeching halt. My family was amazed at the amount of control I had over my dogs. Again, they both know what would have come next.

I see a lot of people having problems with their sibes pulling on lead. I rarely have this issue. I've done a lot of positive training so he knows exactly what is expected of him. He can roam wherever he wants on his flexilead. He can sniff or mark anything he wants. He can walk ahead of or behind me. I don't care. The walk is for him. When he used to pull I would do the 180s, or I would just stop so he knew he couldn't get to what he wanted until he stopped pulling. I made sure to leave no doubt as to what my expectations are on walks. It was all done through positive reinforcement. Once in a while he "forgets" and starts pulling. A solid tug on his lead and me commanding "slow down" usually fixes it. If not (which is very rare now), hitting him fixes it very quickly. We can go for 45 mins after that and he suddenly remembers not to pull on the lead, and that we walk at MY pace, not his.

When I was 14-16 I worked on a farm for this guy named Rusty. He was one of the most influential people in my life. In addition to being a farmer, he hauled water, drove a school bus, taught 6th grade science, and held two master's degrees (in science, and education, I believe). I had nothing but respect for the old man. I learned many lessons from him about how to live, and how to be a man. One thing he taught me, which summed up my relationship with my father perfectly was: "every young boy needs a man he looks up to, admires, and fears just a little bit". That's how I felt with my old man. When I was young, I loved him, knew he loved me, and had a great relationship with him. However, I knew who was in charge, and what happened if I messed up. I see caring for a dog in the same manner: I love them, they both know it, they love me, but they understand there will be consequences for bad behaviour.

People that have come to my house that don't own dogs see me interact and comment on how much I "love my dogs". I now know what my parents meant when they said "this hurts me more than it hurts you". I don't enjoy hitting my dogs. I don't set them up for failure so I can hit them. I love them both more than words on this forum could ever convey. With that said, there's not a bit of doubt in either of their minds as to who is in charge.

*Flame suit on*

Thoughts?

[mydiamond]

just as the "saying" goes, if you put three dog trainers in the same room the only thing that the two would agree with is that the third one is wrong. Every person has a different training method and as long as the dog is part of the family and gets his/her basic needs fulfilled, we shouldn't really mess or judge people just by their training method. Diamond got a touch on the neck if he went overboard, and I've had people telling me I'm too rough with my dog as well. A friend of mine is very strict with her guard dog. What is called "serious voice" in her household is pretty much a very loud yell. The dog is also let loose at night to guard the house--which is also a store and workplace. The dog is alone, and there are lots of possibilities that he would be badly harmed if an armed robber actually showed up. He was also fed rice and chicken his entire life just like most dogs in Indo. In my most honest opinion, my friend's family is not a responsible owner. But is the dog abused? Nope. Breeno (RIP) loves his life and he's a well-loved family member. Am I appalled by my friend's training method? Oh yes you bet. Do I call her an abuser? Nope. Through years of being a part of this amazing forum I learned that people differ SO much in training methods and point of views. Just because one opinion is globally "recognized", doesn't mean that everyone MUST use that method. This is one of those lovely forums where people do not judge and respect the wide variety of point of views in the world of dog training. Don't be afraid to share your views

[stormchaser09]

I am pleased your dogs are so well behaved, however having 2 kids of my own and working with 40 preschool children every day I cannot condone violence towards kids. I get comments on a regular basis on how wellmannered my teenage kids are and I have not needed to resort to hitting them. Each to their own. My dogs are managed in a way that we are all happy with and no-one gets hit.

[Tan J P]

Everybody will have their own training methods

but i'm sorry i personally dont like nor agree with yours

'if they go after the cat they will get hit'.........hit or not one day you may well find that they actually do get the cat....its their prey drive and cant be beaten out of them!

'if i catch them eating people food that got left out,they both know pain comes next'..........

wow.....maybe i'm different cos' all but one of my dogs are rescue dogs,2 of which came to me so scared if you even raised your voice and raise your hand near their heads and they cowered.......an awful thing to see!!

so no i wont ever physically correct my dogs,i wont say they are the best behaved dogs in the world but they are loved.

i do usually say each to their own but your methods just horrify me to be honest,imo there are far better ways to train your dog.

[Ron Tao&Sky]

I don't condone any sort of violence to any animal. If you can't control your dogs without hitting them, then in my eyes you shouldn't have dogs............Ron

[Cherrie-Nanook-Indy]

I'm on the fence about this one. As a kid if I was naughty I would get a slap on my legs, so I don't believe that mothers who smack should be publicly stoned and shamed, I think i turned out ok? But I'm not sure with dogs, I know there's has been times that Iv felt like it but Iv always held back. Plus with our boy he had been abused so I don'tt think he would be able to come out the other side knowing he is still loved.

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[Rosemary]

I am a mother of a grown up daughter - not once in her life did I lift a hand to her. There were occasions when I wanted to, I admit, but never did. She was brought up to know the rules and the consequences of breaking them - those consequences were being grounded or privileges being taken away. The same goes for my huskies - same rules apply, and believe me, they know when they have been bad.

The day I hit my dog, I hope someone is around to give me a firm slap.

I have no doubt that you love your dogs as much as I love mine - we just disagree on some things.

[Val (Zebedee)]

I think something that can get "misconstrued" is "hitting a dog". Is it a tap to the rear end, a rap on the nose or as extreme as a full on smack that knocks the dog sideways? What can therefore be defined as violence?

I think you are expecting some kind of reaction by virtue of the title & you put your *flame suit on*

I have 2 sons, now aged 23 & 21. I never hit them, they just got "the look" and knew they had displeased me! Even now, I don't have to say a word, "the look" is enough! But that doesn't work on huskies.

Diesel still lowers his head if you come at him to stroke him - what has happened in the past to invoke that reaction? I dunno. But he is so well behaved, he's not an issue. Kaviq is still a pup (15 months) but he learns so much & so quickly off Myshka & D, he rarely needs correcting already. Myshka, on the other hand, would test the patience of a Saint!! Always has from being a pup (she is the only one we've had from puppy, the boys are rescues).

I let them pull, that is my choice - I only correct it when they pull too much (I usually have 2 on a walking belt) by stopping till they ease off; after a few times of doing that, they walk at fully stretched lead but don't pull. I will not deny, Mysh has had a rap on the snout when she repeatedly, stubbornly does not learn but I would not "belt" her or "smack" her.

[ponder85]

I'm surprised I already have as many replies to this thread. Cool!

I am pleased your dogs are so well behaved, however having 2 kids of my own and working with 40 preschool children every day I cannot condone violence towards kids. I get comments on a regular basis on how wellmannered my teenage kids are and I have not needed to resort to hitting them. Each to their own. My dogs are managed in a way that we are all happy with and no-one gets hit.

Eh... guess my parents sucked then. You've never been around kids that seriously needed to be taught a lesson? For some kids, "timeouts" just don't work. I would also argue that preschool children probably aren't at an age where they are expected to know how to properly behave. Working with kids, you would know better than me. That seems too young. I got spanked once around that age. I shoved my sister's head into gravel. I don't know why. I do know that I never did it again.

Everybody will have their own training methods

but i'm sorry i personally dont like nor agree with yours

'if they go after the cat they will get hit'.........hit or not one day you may well find that they actually do get the cat....its their prey drive and cant be beaten out of them!

'if i catch them eating people food that got left out,they both know pain comes next'..........

wow.....maybe i'm different cos' all but one of my dogs are rescue dogs,2 of which came to me so scared if you even raised your voice and raise your hand near their heads and they cowered.......an awful thing to see!!

so no i wont ever physically correct my dogs,i wont say they are the best behaved dogs in the world but they are loved.

i do usually say each to their own but your methods just horrify me to be honest,imo there are far better ways to train your dog.

Interesting you mention yours are rescue dogs. My sibe was a shelter rescue who was pretty timid at first, and my GSD was acquired from craigslist, from a family that treated her poorly. My GSD used to move her head the second I moved my hand to pet her. Her confidence is up now and I think she's happy. I never said mine were the best behaved either. Heel for both of them is an ongoing struggle

I don't condone any sort of violence to any animal. If you can't control your dogs without hitting them, then in my eyes you shouldn't have dogs............Ron

I would be willing to bet more than 50% of dog owners have struck their dogs on at least one occassion. Keep in mind that those of us on a dog forum are the vast minority. By your logic all those dogs should be taken to a shelter and killed (what else would happen to all the dogs that shouldn't be in possession of their violent owners?). Can you justify your reason for thinking that I shouldn't have dogs because I hit them?

I am a mother of a grown up daughter - not once in her life did I lift a hand to her. There were occasions when I wanted to, I admit, but never did. She was brought up to know the rules and the consequences of breaking them - those consequences were being grounded or privileges being taken away. The same goes for my huskies - same rules apply, and believe me, they know when they have been bad.

The day I hit my dog, I hope someone is around to give me a firm slap.

I have no doubt that you love your dogs as much as I love mine - we just disagree on some things.

I guess a few of you got lucky with your kids. Maybe I was a bad kid. I had a few groundings, corner time, etc. There was nothing that ever changed my attitude like my parents grabbing a belt.

[simhauu]

I, and I think majority of the husky owners at least those I met don't use flexileads, I use a short 2 m leash for walks, and then 15 m long leash when we go to woods or fields. Do you use flexilead? The pulling can be quite different but still huskies were meant to pull, owners who complain want to change them. I did use the halti head when Ghost was small because he had and still has so much power in those 4 legs of his that I didn't think I'll be able to control him later but everything's possible. That's mainly when I go out in the wrong shoes in which it's impossible to stop because my normal sneakers are drying.

[ponder85]

I think something that can get "misconstrued" is "hitting a dog". Is it a tap to the rear end, a rap on the nose or as extreme as a full on smack that knocks the dog sideways? What can therefore be defined as violence?

I think you are expecting some kind of reaction by virtue of the title & you put your *flame suit on*

I have 2 sons, now aged 23 & 21. I never hit them, they just got "the look" and knew they had displeased me! Even now, I don't have to say a word, "the look" is enough! But that doesn't work on huskies.

Diesel still lowers his head if you come at him to stroke him - what has happened in the past to invoke that reaction? I dunno. But he is so well behaved, he's not an issue. Kaviq is still a pup (15 months) but he learns so much & so quickly off Myshka & D, he rarely needs correcting already. Myshka, on the other hand, would test the patience of a Saint!! Always has from being a pup (she is the only one we've had from puppy, the boys are rescues).

I let them pull, that is my choice - I only correct it when they pull too much (I usually have 2 on a walking belt) by stopping till they ease off; after a few times of doing that, they walk at fully stretched lead but don't pull. I will not deny, Mysh has had a rap on the snout when she repeatedly, stubbornly does not learn but I would not "belt" her or "smack" her.

Yes, I was expecting a reaction. I knew what I wrote was going against the general concensus of the board. Is there something wrong with that? Should ideas and perceptions not be challenged for the greater good of all? I'm not saying my way is right. Convince me I'm wrong; I'm open to it. If I'm wrong I'll happily admit it for the benefit of my dogs. I'm wrong all the time. I'll concede I do enjoy constructive debate, I think it betters all parties. If you're not ok with that, don't reply to my thread. I never claimed my way was absolutely correct. I do, however, claim its effective. Can you tell me why its not the best approach?

The title was my honest opinion. And based on the replies, was fairly accurate (I hope I'm not actually hated, but you understand what I mean).

And *flame suit on* meant I fully expected, and was ok with, getting flamed. Basically I don't want people to hold back. Tell me your honest opinions.

What's the difference btwn "rap on the snout", and smacking? I never said I do, nor have I ever, "belt" my dogs.

How long have you had D? I often wonder about the past of my dogs. The husky came in as a stray, so not much is known. Like I said before, the Shepherd was from Craigslist, and that poor girl didn't have the greatest start to life. It took Bailey about 6 months to stop lowering her head or jerking away when we stroked her. I was pretty excited yesterday, she had eye boogies (not sure that's the scientific name, lol) and she didn't budge her head when I got them out. I didn't hold her or anything, just stuck my finger in her eye and got them out.

[ponder85]

I, and I think majority of the husky owners at least those I met don't use flexileads, I use a short 2 m leash for walks, and then 15 m long leash when we go to woods or fields. Do you use flexilead? The pulling can be quite different but still huskies were meant to pull, owners who complain want to change them. I did use the halti head when Ghost was small because he had and still has so much power in those 4 legs of his that I didn't think I'll be able to control him later but everything's possible. That's mainly when I go out in the wrong shoes in which it's impossible to stop because my normal sneakers are drying.

I can't think of a reason not to use flexilead. They get to roam, and it's easy to "reel them in" if a car is coming. I understand huskies were meant to pull. Mine gets a chance in his harness, when I'm on my bike. I expect him to know that he can't pull when he's on a collar and not on his harness.

Ha, we tried a gentle leader... he HATED it. For him it was take two steps, fight gentle leader. Then I'd pull him. Two more steps, fight gentle leader... FREEDOM! (as it came off) lol. He does fine without it now.

[BingBlaze n Skyla]

I don't have a physical need 2 punish my dogs when I can redirect n teach them using treats and just verbal commands I believe I'm positive reinforcement not negative

I suppose it depends how hard your hitting I guess I wouldn't hate someone who gave their dog a tap but someone who say backhanded their dog so they yelp from the contact I wouldn't be happy with at all

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[simhauu]

I can't think of a reason not to use flexilead. They get to roam, and it's easy to "reel them in" if a car is coming. I understand huskies were meant to pull. Mine gets a chance in his harness, when I'm on my bike. I expect him to know that he can't pull when he's on a collar and not on his harness.

Ha, we tried a gentle leader... he HATED it. For him it was take two steps, fight gentle leader. Then I'd pull him. Two more steps, fight gentle leader... FREEDOM! (as it came off) lol. He does fine without it now.

Positive reinforcement with treats helped me. For some reason mine ducks before the harness. He knows it allows me to better control him or what.

I consider them way too thin, lol.

[Emma]

The problem I have with smackkng, is that there is a very fine line between firm discipline and border line abuse and not everyone can see the distinction between the two. Smacking a child on the leg without force, leaving no marks at all is currently legal in the U.K. as far as I can recall (legal does not mean it is reccomended or advisable). However smacking across the face, leaving a handprint or any mark whatsoever is a child abuse case. I would like to point out that physical injury is not what concerns me most. It's the damage psychologically that's the most destructive to both the child/dog in question and where's the measure for that exactly? We all know from researches done in the past that an animal or child who is treated aggressively will learn this behaviour and accept it as the normal and acceptable way to behave. This in turn will impact on thier behaviour as they will be more suseptible to becoming aggressive themselves in response to stressful situations as this is what they have been taught to do!

Therefore I would never advocate smacking or overly aggressive behaviour as part of a training programme.

I will not lie to you however as on 1 occasion my husband has smacked Ice. I will tell you the full story as to what happened and why.....

I came home from work one day and the 2 huskies came to greet me at the door as normal. My elderly staff and 2 children were at the other end of the hallway waiting for me to apporach them. Unbeknown to Brooke (my staff) she was standing over a toy that Ice had found in the long grass outside. Ice turned around and in seconds he had charged across the hallway and pinned Brooke to the ground, biting and injuring her, while she lay belly up in a submissive pose, refusing to fight back. (which is usual for Brooke, in a fight or flight scenario, her instincts tell her to flee or play dead.) my children and I were all frozen to the spot in shock and my children were standing right besides this fight. My husband shouted at my children to get back but they didn't move or even seem to hear him. He clapped his hands loudly and shouted to try to break it up but Ice didn't respond and then he smacked Ice on the bottom once and he let go of Brooke and turned to face my husband then layed on the floor, belly up. This all happened in seconds, literally the whole incident was over in say 10-15 seconds and smacking Ice was not apremeditated action by my husband, it was purely an instinctive move to try and protect his children from getting harmed and to save his beloved Brooke from gettting hurt worse than she had been (a few minor cuts to her head but nothing more serious, thank god). I am not happy that he smacked Ice but given the severity of the situation, I can understand why he did: he had to act fast to save his children from getting hurt accidently and didn't have the luxury of time to be able to find a bucket of water or treat to try to coax him away gently.

I would like to point out that this is not normal behaviour for Ice and has not happened since. It happened because when we took him in he had dog:dog food aggression and not even a particulary bad case either. I believe it stemmed from having to compete for food with litter mates and another dog with his previous owner who had no interest in him and kept him locked in a cage all day. We had all treats and toys hidden on top of the freezer( but must of missed one), while we worked on training him (he's completely fine now BTW, it only took him about 3 months to realise he didn't have to compete for food or guzzle it up in one go, as it will always be given fairly.)

I didn't use any form of aggression to train him, instead what I did was this:

1 Ice fed separately at mealtimes and left undisturbed. Meal placed down once he has followed the sit command and wait command.

2 All toys and treats to be removed to avoid uneccessary arguements.

3 Any time one dog is allowed a treat, all dogs are allowed a treat. Once they have perfomed the sit and then paw command.

4 Occassionally I opened the kitchen door whilst he was eating in the room on the other side. He could then see the other dogs eating in the kitchen but knew he still had his own food. If he tried to charge them he was put back and the door was closed again.

5 As time passed he bacame less desperate to protect his food, so was allowed around the other dogs when eating.

6 And most importantly of all, HE WAS GIVEN TIME TO BE ALLOWED TO ADJUST AND LEARN. HE WAS NOT PUT UP FOR SALE OR GIVEN UP ON, IT WAS UNDERSTOOD THAT HE WAS NOT A 'BAD DOG', 'DOMINANT DOG', 'AGRESSIVE DOG'. HE JUST DIDN'T KNOW ANY DIFFERENT. WE SHOWED HIM A DIFFERENT PATH AND HE FOLLOWED. It really was that simple, although emotionally it was knackering and frustrating at times I will admit!

Sorry this was so long winded but I'm trying to be as honest and descriptive as I can.

[Dunc]

I've never hit a animal or any child but I've hit a few adults that have....................

[Removed #5]

I'm sort of in the middle on this topic.

Avalanche and I, in play are really rough with each other and he gets 'slapped' regularly (I'm careful that it's not on joints or in his face) but with him it's all play. If I walk past him, I may 'hit' him - but I view this as much like a friend walking up and slapping me on the shoulder, it's "affectionate" and not taken as a beating, he also may grab my pants leg as I go past - all in fun.

Sasha, on the other hand, has never been hit by me - honestly because I'm not sure what her reaction would be if I did. She's displayed some aggression and I don't need her responding to what she might see as aggression with more of her own.

As far as kids go, I have none of my own but when I was going with my last long term lady friend who had an 8 year old, we were getting ready to go on a week-end camp. His one responsibility before we left was to put up the dishes from the dish washer. He stood by the machine giving his mom every reason he could think of to put it off. I'd been watching this for probably in the range of 10 minutes or so. I walked up behind him, popped him on the derriere ( got a shocked look from both him and his mother ) the rest of the exchange went something like this:

me: do you want to go to the sitters for the weekend?

him: no, sir (( "sir", that was unusual! ))

me: you do want to go with us this weekend?

him: yes, sir

me: what do you have to do before we go?

him: put the dishes up.

me: you're not doing that, are you?

him: no, sir ... yes, sir

(( looking at his mother ))

me: did that hurt?

him: no, just surprised me ...

BTW, the camping trip was really for him (he's never been camping) and me (I enjoy camping), his mother sorta agreed to go along ...

That's also the way I treat my dogs. I work with treats and good vibes, but when it reaches the point where they don't respond and time is of the essence, then they're apt to get 'popped' - it's not a painful hit, it's a tap to say "Give me your attention, NOW!"

Do I condone someone actually beating their dog - in no way! I don't like collars that can be painful, though I've used choke collars in the past until the dog has learned not to pull unrelentingly.

There are ways to use "hitting" that are not painful, not seen as aggression that must be responded to, so I do use those when needed but other than beating the blazes out of Avalanche - who comes back for more of it! No, I generally don't haul off and hit my dogs.

<< cookies >>

[valkyries]

i have two grown children who have never been hit in their life. i have 3 sib's not one has been hit. now Thor was a rescue and we had war in my house when he arrived, blood off all dogs from his attacks both myself and hubby got bit but even then there was no need to hit him, we trained him with love, attention and time also a commitment to be by his side through the good and bad days to show him we are as commited to him as the other 2.

now with out hitting he's a really layed back dog with a great love for every one. he goes mad if not with the other 2 their all best friends and this was done with love not hitting, theres no need for it in any way shape or form

[Marc]

OK I'll answer a few of your questions, if they are indeed questions:

Why can you physically correct a child and not a dog? - Answer to this is simple. Yeah if a kid "seriously" steps out of line they will get a crack, however the difference is that the child knows why. A dog does not if done for the first time, and therefore all it knows is you hurt it. That IMO is certainly not fair and I will never agree with it. The only time I would ever even entertain hitting a dog is if he/she had hold of another person/dog and would not let go, and then its through complete lack of option.

Hit for chasing the cat? If you are doing this I urge you to completely stop that now. If you think this is fine then you have obviously not researched about having a husky in the first place. Huskies have a very high pray drive and they will chase/even kill small animals. You are hitting him for an instinct he may be unable to control. Its the equivilant of someone hitting you when you jump after touching a hot fire. Its instinctive.

Play hitting? If you are punching and stopping a few inches from his nose, and you have accidentally hit him a few times. STOP IT. Its not rocket science and Im sorry but that is plain irresponsible regardless of your training methods. You are doing something that could potentially hurt your dog when doing nothing wrong, and then trying to teach him that when you hurt him he is doing something wrong. Therefore everytime you hit him my accident you have just taught him he is not allowed to play (by your own training method)

Also just to note, you say you are the only person using this method. That in itself makes your training pointless as you have given only yourself the tools to correct your dog. All you have done is stopped anyone else from correcting your dog, and Im sorry if this offends but one day someone will be bitten. Its not an if, its a when.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Marc

[Shaiasaur]

Everyone has different methods of training, everyone is different, and no one has to be the same.

In my honest opinion, I do not believe in hitting an animal to "put them in their place"

When I first got my cat Tails, he was a bad little baby haha, I tapped him on the nose and spanked his butt, and I did that a few times until I couldn't stand doing it anymore because that is what my father told me to do.

One my dad took Tails and threw him across the room, and I was infuriated, I yelled at him and took Tails and locked up in my room for an hour or so.

I regret spanking Tails but people said it helps, and it didn't, it just hurt me, and Tails.

I just think that it makes the animal not trust you and afraid it pretty much be itself.

Maybe in your case it didn't end up that way, but then again it is my opinion.

I respect yours as long as you respect mine, simple and easy as that.

[jessiezara90]

Hmmm, I don't personally raise my hand to my dogs, but when I was little my GSD ate one of the chickens and my dad did give him quite a telling off and smacking for it which really upset the rest of us. But then he never went near the chickens again, so yes I think it can may be effective but not in the healthy way.. There are loads of different over methods out there, If you can use positive ways then surely that better than being negative

[Austinville]

I believe your "training" method is responded to out of fear.......but that's just my opinion.

I've had two huskies over the past 18 years. I raised two children over the past 26 years. I have two grandchildren over the past three years. Not once have I ever disciplined any one of them with pain.

[Bec]

If a client came to see us and we advised them to hit their dog I can't imagine we would get as much business as we do now.

There is, IMO, nothing wrong with giving a physical correction in training when it's appropriate. But a correction should never be given out of anger or because the handler has gotten frustrated and no longer has control. I don't think hitting a dog is necessary and I also am yet to see any instance where it was the best and most effective option.

You said yourself that your dog still chases the cat and still pulls on the leash so it stands to reason that when you have hit them for doing those things it isn't actually working as they still do it again. It might interrupt the behaviour in that moment but it's not changing the habit otherwise they wouldn't keep doing it.

Personally hitting my dogs is not something I'd be proud of doing or something I would want to brag about. I know of many dogs who if hit would have no qualms taking you up on the challenge. My own dog would have to be belted before hitting her had any effect. I don't understand the reason behind hitting them and being proud of it especially when it's clearly not very effective and there are so many other options available.

[Lavs]

My dog Hammer, GSD husky mix, was a rescue and he will literally cower when you raise your voice to him. No matter what he does I do not hit him, but I do give him ****, and if I point at him he knows he's in trouble.

Sonoma all I ever did to her was tap her on the nose with said pointer finger once as a pup when she bit me and drew blood. Now she knows the "point" means not to do that and that was the end of it. I do consider myself very lucky that my two understand this and I didn't ever need to physically discapline them, however I've seen some people's dogs who require that type of punishment. No I'm not talking kicks to the head or hitting them so hard they yelp or cry, but a tap on the nose or a swat in the rear isn't going to scar them or make them cross. Dogs in nature have a way of physically discaplining their pups and members of a pack, so I believe a gentle reminder at times really isn't the most horrible thing for them. I do not condone abuse, as I said Hammer is a rescue and I've seen first hand the real damage abuse does to dogs and the effects last a lifetime. Hammer knows I don't hit him, however if someone tried I, unfortunately couldn't guarentee he wouldn't turn cross towards that person in that moment. He's a great dog all around but the remnants of his youth are still present at times, and as much as it breaks my heart to see it I can't undo what was done to him before we got him.

You do what you need to do to a point to teach your dog what is not appropriate, however for the people who seem to get off on beating their dogs senseless, well there's a place for them, they'll get theirs.

*done*

Edited June 17, 2012 by Marc

[Christine0925]

I personally prefer respect>fear. Does a dog still respect you after it has physically 'learned it's lesson?' Probably not, but smart enough to know what comes next if he does something bad. Is that good enough for some people? Absolutely! and there may be nothing wrong with that. My choice of relationship with my dog is different, and that's ok to!