Stranger Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Although I am not quite ready to buy a new pup, I want to make sure when I do buy a pup I am buying it from the right people. But how do you tell who the right people are? When getting Kaiden and Parker, we just search through Pet4homes, and found dogs for sale in our local area (wasn’t looking for breed specifics, to think, I could of ended up something other than a husky). We visited a couple of dogs which didn’t seem to expensive, and that we liked the look of, we didn’t look for anything like is it KC register, are they Hip scored, etc, etc. So who are the right people to buy from? I know that if I found a husky that when I went to visit, the house wasn’t over run with dogs, the mum looked happy, and the owners knew what they were talking about, and asked me questions as well as me asking questions I wouldn’t be worried, obviously checking that the mum looked healthy too rather than run down (possible signed of over breeding). Other than the obvious signs of a real back yard breeder who is only in it for the money, (loads of dogs, run down mum, etc) how do you decide if it’s a good idea to buy or not to buy, I want to help reduce BYB, when will I know when I am buying from one? Much luv Toni xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicTurtle Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 I've bought from two breeders who are listed on the AKC site, but unfortunately both of them ended up being not quite so honest or moral. I also bought from a small show kennel with limited breedings - sweet woman, but she sent me the wrong dog when she shipped him. The only advice I have is to visit the home and look at the conditions of where the pups are kept as well as asking to see the health check paper work or registry number online. If you are going to get contracts, do it before the money has changed hands. There is always a gamble if you don't physically go see the place and pick up the pup yourself. You can also ask why they are breeding. If they are breeding because its their source of income and not to produce dogs that meet the breed standards or to produce show dogs, then they are doing it for the wrong reasons and qualify as a BYB even if they are great people who only have two dogs. Now, having said that, I had an accidental breeding last year and needed to find homes for the pups. I felt horribly embarrassed and like a BYB and thank goodness I found good homes for the babies. I might buy a dog from someone in the same situation if I got a good feeling about them and they gave me a contract or health guarantee. Even just them admitting that it wasn't planned would make me feel like they were being honest and is a point in their favor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stranger Posted July 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 I've bought from two breeders who are listed on the AKC site, but unfortunately both of them ended up being not quite so honest or moral. I also bought from a small show kennel with limited breedings - sweet woman, but she sent me the wrong dog when she shipped him. The only advice I have is to visit the home and look at the conditions of where the pups are kept as well as asking to see the health check paper work or registry number online. If you are going to get contracts, do it before the money has changed hands. There is always a gamble if you don't physically go see the place and pick up the pup yourself. You can also ask why they are breeding. If they are breeding because its their source of income and not to produce dogs that meet the breed standards or to produce show dogs, then they are doing it for the wrong reasons and qualify as a BYB even if they are great people who only have two dogs. Now, having said that, I had an accidental breeding last year and needed to find homes for the pups. I felt horribly embarrassed and like a BYB and thank goodness I found good homes for the babies. I might buy a dog from someone in the same situation if I got a good feeling about them and they gave me a contract or health guarantee. Even just them admitting that it wasn't planned would make me feel like they were being honest and is a point in their favor. i would be planning on having "it" done as would not be looking to show or breed, but its finding out who is a genuine BYB or like yourself accidental, not may people are honest these days i dont suppose there are any tell tell signs, someone doing it for money properly will already have all the "answers/Lies" ready Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Removed #5 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Let's start with the obvious bad situation - accidents do happen and when they do, the people do need to find homes for their accidental pups. Since enough of us have mixed breeds it's worth taking the time to discuss that aspect. If they have a full blood <x> and know who the other parent is you've off to a decent start. If you visit them and the dam is a good healthy dog, so much the better and if they know who the sire is and you can meet-and-greet him and his people you have a really good opportunity to see what your potential may become. How are they being cared for? Are the pups being fed well and properly for their age, are they housed with the family or totally in kennels? That makes a big difference in the puppy experience, which makes a big difference in the adult. While you're there, take the time to get to know the people from whom you're buying. What do they do for a living? If they're employed, what do they do? Asked in chit-chat it doesn't become quite as obvious that you're asking if they breed for a living or not. Are they interested in you? If not then they're just trying to get rid of a problem - don't let it become your problem. Even mixed breed pups should have some value ( unless getting it from a friend ) "you get what you pay for" is an old adage but true from different angles. If they've had their first shots, etc then $50-$75 ( or more? for example ) isn't unreasonable - just make sure you get the papers that support the vaccinations. If they haven't then you can kinda figure the value the pups (and dogs) have for the people you're considering - don't! With one exception, in my mind, everything I've said so far also holds true if you're looking at buying a pure breed. The exception is the prices, expect to pay more. But there are added considerations, if you're looking at a breed with known genetic problems have the parents been tested and shown to be free of these problems - ask to see the paperwork! If they can't produce it, or the dogs haven't been tested or the dags are not clean, you're in the wrong place. Do they have a contract and what's in it? If the dog does present symptoms will they refund all or part of your payment? Will they take the dog back ( and replace it or refund your payment )? Will they require you to return the dog to them if you have to surrender it for any reason? A good reputable breeder will expect this and it's part of his mindset. If you're buying a pure breed, ask to see the papers on the parents and the paperwork submitted to date for the pups. I'd go so far as to ask for a copy of the parents papers. This all, btw is strictly off the cuff so I expect others to add to my lists ... but if you have answers to all these questions you should have a real good feel for whether you're dealing with a BYB or someone who bred intentionally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleLuka Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 my breeder had a very nice enclosure they had built to help give their dogs some areas to roam and play. They all slept inside every night in individual crates and they had been socialized with children. You could tell the family loved their dogs. They all were groomed very well (no matting or dirty) they all looked healthy and definitely well taken care of. I was asked to sign a contract to purchase my puppy promising that i would return my puppy to them if for any reason i could not keep him. It also stated that if for any reason the dog was not taken care of or abandoned they could seize him. (This wasn't a worry for me considering i take very good care of Luka) And it also mentioned that if for any reason my puppy had problems (listed health issues) they would take him and give me another puppy. which btw it's kind of stupid in my personal opinion because even if luka had an issue i would never trade him in. Luka had already been given a round of shots and de-wormer and i was presented with the vet records of this. His mother and father were both present at the time i picked my puppy out, anytime i visited him, and when i came to take him home. He was registered and i was given full documentation verifying this. They were interested in what i planned on doing with Luka and basically how i just lived my life. They also made it VERY clear that their puppies are not bred for breeding purposes. They don't want their puppies to wind up being treated like mill dogs. I would also like to mention they are limited on how many puppies they produce. You won't see them producing multiple litters per year. Overall, you can tell simply by the way they take care of their animals and how they react to you. Overall i wound up paying $550 for my boy. This is cheap compared to some of the other prices i've seen. I wasn't looking for a show quality dog. I mean he still has papers and all of that but i got him for a best friend, not a show dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Melsom Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Well lets start with this...a good dog is never cheap. Responsible breeders do health testing on their dogs and give them the best possible care and that can get expensive so never look for the best deal. Usually the Kennel Club has a preferred breeders list and usually lists good breeders there. If a person registers their dogs it does not make them a responsible breeder. I have recently been talking with breeders about a lady who has a merle husky and shes determined that it is purebred because it is registered. Purebred huskies don't come in merle! or brindle. I find breeders that show their dogs tend to be responsible breeders then again there are people who say they do and they don't and then put fake "Ch" in front on their names. Another way I guess would be to find somebody who has gotten a dog from a great breeder and avoid classifieds although I know some responsible breeders that use them most of the time classifieds are just bad news. You could also get references and just look out for the signs like the breeder should be interviewing you like your adopting a child they should have A LOT of questions to ask you about your whole life They will want to keep in contact with you, they will take a dog back if ever you couldn't keep it anymore and they will offer a health guarantee and they will usually have a "non-breeding" contract responsible breeders care a lot about their dogs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Povodny Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) When I was looking for Loki I came across a breeder who had a huge fancy website, I contacted them and they had a litter available to look at. They seemed really nice, they knew what they were about seemingly. They talked about hip and eye scores, they wanted a contract signing and a non refundable deposit put down. They also wanted me to pick my puppy at a week old. Me being an inexperienced buyer thought this was the norm. The first thing that bothered me was when we arranged to visit them, instead of providing an address for us to go to, they wanted to meet us at an exit on the motorway in Hull and us follow them to their home. I thought it odd but then wondered if it was slight security paranoia on their part. They explained their home was hard to find using sat nav as it didn't show on most sat nav devices. When we got there we got a convoluted story about why the wife wasn't there. The dam was in a crate with the puppies in a cold kitchen and we got to see him. It was explained to us about the contract, we were told there were other people interested in the pup and we had to decide there an then. We caved an handed over the deposit, signed the contract, took our copy and left. I think we were there 20 minutes tops. We'd driven 2hrs to get there, I came home an kept in touch with them. I asked for pics and was told the camera had been knocked off the kitchen table by a robin that had flown in through the catflap and broken. I arranged to go back when the puppy was 4/5weeks old. I'd emailed the day an date we were going and it was all arranged. They contacted me an tried to get out of it claiming I'd said a different day. I still didn't have either a home phone number or an address, the mobile number was no longer working and I was using email. We drove to hull again, went into a cold house on the 28th of December with snow outside and no heating or fire on inside. They brought the puppy that was shivering from the kennels outside into the kitchen. It was very small and under sized, it didn't respond like a puppy 4/5 weeks old. I expressed concern and they told me they realised it was being pushed out but that it was completely healthy and would catch up. I asked could we go an see it's mother an litter mates, they refused stating there'd been a recent outbreak of blue tongue in the area and Defra had told them no one could go into the goat pen except them and that to get to the kennels you had to pass through the goat pen. They did bring one of the litter mates out for us to see to show us that our pup was a one off and the others were healthy. We couldn't see the mother or dad although they claimed they had both. They assured me they would take the puppy to the vet,have it checked and have him provide documentation to support the fact if I wished. I agreed. I came home and decided to go back on her website an have a closer look, I also called Defra and spoke to the big chief in the hull area and asked about blue tongue. He told me firstly there was no such outbreak or restriction in the area. And secondly even if there was we could still visit the kennel as long as we used a different pair of shoes to walk through the kennel and removed them before leaving and cleaning them. I looked more closely at her dogs and their names and contacted the breeder of her original male that she used to establish her kennel. Needless to say I found out quite a lot, non of which was good. I believe this person was in fact a puppy farm of some sort. She had at least 15 dogs in total and on average 3 litters at any one time. I never had her address, home phone number or in fact in the end a mobile number. I declined on the puppy even though it apparently had a clean bill of health and in the last twelve months I've seen her dogs advertised on pets4homes as she retires them from breeding and restocks again. All I can say is don't be afraid to ask questions, even ones that people can take offence to. Read between the lines and above all, go with your gut. If it doesn't feel right, it very probably isn't. Oh and if you're asked to choose your puppy at a week old. Walk away. From what the breeder I spoke to on the phone whose dog had been used to start the kennel we didn't buy from said. You shouldn't be invited to view a puppy before 4 weeks old. Prior to that they're not developed enough for you to see what kind of temperament they have. Edited July 17, 2012 by Povodny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 If u want a puppy healthy and why u do not try the kennel club scheme also u can read everything u need to know the information are pretty the same as everybody said up on the posts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austinville Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 In addition to the information provided by others, here are tips I would use - First, be prepared to ask many questions from the breeder....for example, regarding YOUR experience with the breed, type of fencing you have and so on. Secondly, one of the first questions I would ask is how many litters are on the ground as you speak. That will give you a huge clue as to whether a breeder is breeding for money for for love. Get copies of eye and hip scores. Doesn't mean you aren't being lied to....but it can be an indicator of future problems. don't be afraid to ask questions of the breeder. Find out at what age their huskies succumb and from what? My breeder was pretty open about that - her line tends to reach the age of 13 to 14, and she provided me with information on what they typically pass from. In turn, I was questioned and re-questioned, which I appreciated. It told me she cared about where her pups went and how they would live and be cared for. In the end, we are friends. I've been at her side when several of her golden oldies have passed and she's been at mine through struggles and frustrations with my Ryn. I would only ever board Ryn in her kennel and she trusts me to care for her pack when she is away (though infrequently). I must have answered the way she'd hoped as I was provided with all rights (including breeding Ryn if I so chose - along with the promise of guidance during the process. I declined that right and had Ryn fixed, but that vote of confidence from my breeder was immeasurable). Ask and answer, look and listen, and above all, listen to your heart. If it says something is wrong, it probably is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stranger Posted July 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Ask and answer, look and listen, and above all, listen to your heart. If it says something is wrong, it probably is. i suppose this is more importan than anything else. thank you all this is very useful to know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmscott Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Here is a plethora of websites that we use ourselves: Breeder Ethics http://www.dogplay.com/Breeding/ethics.html Naturally Reared Breeders Association http://www.nrbreedersassociation.org/breeders.html Health Tested Puppies from Conscientious Breeders http://www.htpuppiescb.com/ Show/work/race http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/02/siberian-husky-types-show-work-and-race.html list of articles relating to choosing a breeder http://www.wonderpuppy.net/1breeding.php#findbreeder guide to newspaper ads http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/02/guide-to-newspaper-ads-for-puppies.html FCI Standard http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/02/fci-standard-for-siberian-husky.html UKC Standard http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/02/ukc-standard-for-siberian-husky.html AKC Standard http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/02/akc-standard-for-siberian-husky.html Inherited Disorders http://originsiberiansdogs.blogspot.com/2012/03/inherited-disorders-of-siberian-husky.html Edited July 17, 2012 by jmscott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stranger Posted July 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 :eek: wow thats alot....will have a ganta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyMom09 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 Ask questions! Don't be afraid to ask how many breeding males and females they have, how many litters they produce each year, what kind of health clearances they have done, want to look at pedigrees and health test results (originals not copies), ask what they do with their dogs are they just pets that breed all the time or are they into showing, sledding, weight pulling etc. Tour their kennels if possible, a nice website can be hiding a bad BYB or puppy mill!! Contact them at different parts of the year and see how many litters they have, poor breeders often have puppies available year round vs. breeders that plan their litters. Expect them to know the breed enough to be questioning you as well! Expect them to answer all of your questions knowledgeably and completely, they start dodging answering any of your questions walk on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.