Maya's Behavior

[Removed #1]

oh no, I wasn't pointing blame at you at all...I think that you guys really got screwed with that, my whole point was more or less to say look our posters have identified issues...look at what happens at dog parks when people aren't responsible for their dogs...nice responsible people get sued

[Mobezilla]

Just wanted to add that Abby has stopped going to the dog park because of these issues, and shes asking for tips on how to resolve them.

[LittleLuka]

this is the first time i've had an issue with Luka being too rough. My dog has been socialized since I got him at 8 weeks old, he's never not been around other dogs. if preventing him from the dog park is what i wind up having to do i will do it. i won't risk my dog's life for a visit to the dog park.

 

However, i believe there must be another way to discourage this behavior.

[MidnightPaws]

Okay so the long lead and removing her from play was something i had thought about doing. So should i also intervene and remove her when she's being too rough with Sophie and Sophie is screaming? i don't mind her putting Sophie in her place but i don't like it when she continuously pins her down and doesn't play with her other then pinning her down.

[Mobezilla]

Would a video of Maya and Cloud interacting help you guys? Cloud is a small dog and Maya can be a bit rough on him, maybe if you see how she interacts with him that might broaden some answers as well. Abby if you want me to bring over Cloud I'm off Thursday ^^

[MidnightPaws]

Would a video of Maya and Cloud interacting help you guys? Cloud is a small dog and Maya can be a bit rough on him, maybe if you see how she interacts with him that might broaden some answers as well. Abby if you want me to bring over Cloud I'm off Thursday ^^

Okay, she was seeming to start to understand that it's not okay for her to be rough with him the last time he was over. If you noticed or not, she would look at me a couple times.

[MidnightPaws]

I have this video that shows a lot of her and Cloud and her and Yuki.

 

http://youtu.be/Hse_YLwVh44

[Removed #1]

There's been some advice given so far...if it's been missed then I'll reiterate it:

 

*Get into contact with other owners you trust who are willing to help you out with the issue.

*Stop the behavior when it happens and redirect to the desired behavior or just take a time out from the situation.

*Repeat repeat repeat.

 

Our furbabies want us to take them places, they want to play with other dogs. They want us to be proud and happy to take them out...but sometimes they don't know how to do that.

 

An example:  We recently went to meet a non profit musher in our area...by we I mean myself, Fox and Eponine.  They were introduced to the 11 I think it was dogs.  They came out one at a time and met Fox and then Eponine...Fox did great, he picked up on social cues, and knew how to correct other dogs that were making him uncomfortable.  Eponine still has a lot of work to do and did not react appropriately at all. 

 

This was met with immediately telling her to stop the unwanted behavior.  Then she stood there and was given praise and reassurance the entire time.  When she began to react negatively she was again immediately corrected, reassured that everything was okay, and when she began to respond positively she was given praise and encouragement (which is essentially her high value treat). 

 

At no point during our visit did we take the leash off of Fox or Eponine.  Why because it's easier to grab a leash than it is to pull two dogs apart.  Fox we're fairly confident will be fine on our next visit, Eponine we're going to have to do more work with. 

 

The couple who has the dogs are incredibly knowledgeable, and they know their dogs as well as I know mine. 

 

I think you're getting hung up on whether or not it's being identified as aggression.  In the end it doesn't matter much, as it's an unwanted behavior and it's not going to go away without work.

[LittleLuka]

that's great advice but my issue is going to remain the same if it doesn't happen consistently. It's not every small dog we see, Sunday was the first time he's acted like that besides with Knox. He's never had a problem in the past but I do agree that I should nip it in the bud now before it does become a problem. I just don't think it's fair to leash him the entire time when we don't have any issues. Maybe if the situation becomes that way I can then leash him.

 

As for him and Knox, They do get rough occasionally and I break it up. However, it's not just Luka... Knox usually initiates it and Luka responds. I separate them until they can play nice which usually takes about a couple of minutes and they are fine.

 

I don't know if you're directing it towards me that I'm getting hung up on aggression or not but my issue isn't whether or not it's aggressive it's how do i correct a problem that isn't persistent or rarely happens?

[Removed #1]

I'm just picking up on the general tone of the thread, so no it's not directed specifically at you.

 

I'm not certain what you mean by it's unfair to have him leashed all the time.  I didn't mean to have him leashed with you holding the leash in your hands the entire time.  You can let it drag...it's just there so that you have a means of intervening without putting yourself between two dogs that are getting too rough...a bite regardless of whether it was on accident or purpose can likely hurt a great deal and safety for you is important.  If you're not safe you can't keep your dogs safe.

 

With the dogs in your home if they're responding to verbal cues then continue to do that.  If you have to physically separate them, that's a problem.

 

It's good that he's not having the issue all the time.  You'd be tearing your hair out likely if he was.  He doesn't have to do it all the time for you to identify and correct the behavior and to give praise and positive reinforcement when he is behaving appropriately.  That's how any behavior is changed...the reward for doing what you'd like him to do is better than the immediate pay-off for doing what feels good just then.

 

If the issue is with both dogs, then it really needs to be addressed with both dogs every time it happens.

[MidnightPaws]

I'm not hung up on whether it's aggression or not cause it doesn't really matter. It's a behavior i want to fix and i appreciate all of the advise. 

 

Luckily Maya listens to verbal cues inside so i'll probably make her stop and sit in a time out for a while then i'll let her continue and if it get's too rough i'll just repeat. Outside i'll probably have the 20' lead on her to grab her and put her in a time out from play. Because she doesn't listen to me well outside with all the excitement. So hopefully she'll learn that she doesn't get to play when she plays like that.

[Christine0925]

I think it's important to know that we all want what's best for our dogs. Honsotly the best advice I can give you is this: if you know your husky is going to come in contact with another dog say going to the dog park having friends dog come over- WALK them first!! A good long walk or bike ride- get that mad out of them!! I bring my dogs to the park and I always make sure we get a good walk in, they are more relaxed

As far as Mya it seems like she keeps doing the behavior of pinning over and over to assert her dominance, after about two times of that I would verbally step in- not acceptable form of play for you. If she doesn't listen be prepared to be following her around the yard and get in a routine where she knows enough is enough. Once you have that TRUST between you and your dog I'd hold off.

As far as luka- was this puppy playin with Knox? Because when we first got dexter he was "hers" and no other dog could play with him only her and she would nudge bump and mouth growl our neighbor dogs when they would lay with him- ( always wants attention!) maybe Luis was letting he puppy know hey he's mine?

Best of luck-

[Christine0925]

Luis lol luka*

[Applebear]

this is the first time i've had an issue with Luka being too rough. My dog has been socialized since I got him at 8 weeks old, he's never not been around other dogs. if preventing him from the dog park is what i wind up having to do i will do it. i won't risk my dog's life for a visit to the dog park.

 

However, i believe there must be another way to discourage this behavior.

 

This is what I'm trying to get at...it's not about going to dog parks or meeting a bunch of new dogs even. It's about a dog that is being too rough with dogs within his pack or social network. I could probably accept my dog [ro] may never be able to play with my friends dogs. But I do have a new dog that will be coming into the pack and that will change things completely. Am I to accept "this is husky, deal with it" or do I try to find solutions so I'm not feeling overwhelmed or like I'm going to have to cut Ro off from the group, excluding him from the family? Do I give up, call the shelter? Or just sit back and ignore him hurting another dog? I can't believe those are my only options.

 

There's been some advice given so far...if it's been missed then I'll reiterate it:

 

*Get into contact with other owners you trust who are willing to help you out with the issue.

*Stop the behavior when it happens and redirect to the desired behavior or just take a time out from the situation.

*Repeat repeat repeat.

 

Our furbabies want us to take them places, they want to play with other dogs. They want us to be proud and happy to take them out...but sometimes they don't know how to do that.

 

An example:  We recently went to meet a non profit musher in our area...by we I mean myself, Fox and Eponine.  They were introduced to the 11 I think it was dogs.  They came out one at a time and met Fox and then Eponine...Fox did great, he picked up on social cues, and knew how to correct other dogs that were making him uncomfortable.  Eponine still has a lot of work to do and did not react appropriately at all. 

 

This was met with immediately telling her to stop the unwanted behavior.  Then she stood there and was given praise and reassurance the entire time.  When she began to react negatively she was again immediately corrected, reassured that everything was okay, and when she began to respond positively she was given praise and encouragement (which is essentially her high value treat). 

 

At no point during our visit did we take the leash off of Fox or Eponine.  Why because it's easier to grab a leash than it is to pull two dogs apart.  Fox we're fairly confident will be fine on our next visit, Eponine we're going to have to do more work with. 

 

The couple who has the dogs are incredibly knowledgeable, and they know their dogs as well as I know mine. 

 

I think you're getting hung up on whether or not it's being identified as aggression.  In the end it doesn't matter much, as it's an unwanted behavior and it's not going to go away without work.

 

Ok this helps a lot and I really appreciate you taking the time. we have tried many methods like this. Having him on a leash works best, but we still struggle a lot. I could see where we're just not getting enough consistency as we don't see the other dogs every day, but when my pup is here...maybe I'll have a bit more success? By what you are saying above, it is possible to 'tone it down' by teaching him which behavior gets him excluded or corrected. And then the ones that get praised.

 

So a couple questions would be...when I get new dog, should I use a leash in house? Or would putting him behind a gate [excluding/time out] be more effective? When with my friend, should we both have our dogs on leashes or just mine? Sometimes hers will take advantage and jump him in the middle of correction [it's called instant recovery]. I'm not sure how I am suppose to be correcting a behavior when hers are allowed to do the same thing in the middle of it...I understand they aren't hurting him the same, but I'm wondering if it's unreasonable to expect her to take control during these moments as well and not make it so one sided?

[Removed #2]

oh no, I wasn't pointing blame at you at all...I think that you guys really got screwed with that, my whole point was more or less to say look our posters have identified issues...look at what happens at dog parks when people aren't responsible for their dogs...nice responsible people get sued

Yes, I knew you were not pointing blame...just thought it needed clarification for the rest.  You've met Jack, so you know he is just a really excitable marshmallow.

[Removed #1]

This is what I'm trying to get at...it's not about going to dog parks or meeting a bunch of new dogs even. It's about a dog that is being too rough with dogs within his pack or social network. I could probably accept my dog [ro] may never be able to play with my friends dogs. But I do have a new dog that will be coming into the pack and that will change things completely. Am I to accept "this is husky, deal with it" or do I try to find solutions so I'm not feeling overwhelmed or like I'm going to have to cut Ro off from the group, excluding him from the family? Do I give up, call the shelter? Or just sit back and ignore him hurting another dog? I can't believe those are my only options.

 

 

Ok this helps a lot and I really appreciate you taking the time. we have tried many methods like this. Having him on a leash works best, but we still struggle a lot. I could see where we're just not getting enough consistency as we don't see the other dogs every day, but when my pup is here...maybe I'll have a bit more success? By what you are saying above, it is possible to 'tone it down' by teaching him which behavior gets him excluded or corrected. And then the ones that get praised.

 

So a couple questions would be...when I get new dog, should I use a leash in house? Or would putting him behind a gate [excluding/time out] be more effective? When with my friend, should we both have our dogs on leashes or just mine? Sometimes hers will take advantage and jump him in the middle of correction [it's called instant recovery]. I'm not sure how I am suppose to be correcting a behavior when hers are allowed to do the same thing in the middle of it...I understand they aren't hurting him the same, but I'm wondering if it's unreasonable to expect her to take control during these moments as well and not make it so one sided?

 

Do you want to risk your best friends accidentally biting you when you try to intervene...or pick up a leash off he ground and pull the dog out of the situation while giving a verbal correction?  I'm not keen on the idea of being bitten personally. 

 

With your friend...I would talk to her about the behavior blatently.  Explain that you recognize that it's not something that should be reinforced by her dog or your dog, and ask that she leave a leash on just again so that intervening doesn't result in stitches or even a bandaid.  I can't stress enough that if the people aren't safe and not in pain they can't do much to help the dogs. 

 

Corrections...if she's who you're going to be working with on this then yes the both of you need to be on the same page!!!!  I really am so lucky that I have Bonnie and the Door County Sled Dogs to help me with Eponine's social retardedness.

[MidnightPaws]

Do you want to risk your best friends accidentally biting you when you try to intervene...or pick up a leash off he ground and pull the dog out of the situation while giving a verbal correction?  I'm not keen on the idea of being bitten personally. 

 

With your friend...I would talk to her about the behavior blatently.  Explain that you recognize that it's not something that should be reinforced by her dog or your dog, and ask that she leave a leash on just again so that intervening doesn't result in stitches or even a bandaid.  I can't stress enough that if the people aren't safe and not in pain they can't do much to help the dogs. 

 

Corrections...if she's who you're going to be working with on this then yes the both of you need to be on the same page!!!!  I really am so lucky that I have Bonnie and the Door County Sled Dogs to help me with Eponine's social retardedness.

 

I've been bit by Kay on my leg, it was not fun! I try now to do things that will prevent me from being bit, but i'm kinda happy Kay bit me rather then Maya's face like she was trying to. I wish i had someone like that around here that could help me with my dogs. 

[LittleLuka]

I think it's important to know that we all want what's best for our dogs. Honsotly the best advice I can give you is this: if you know your husky is going to come in contact with another dog say going to the dog park having friends dog come over- WALK them first!! A good long walk or bike ride- get that mad out of them!! I bring my dogs to the park and I always make sure we get a good walk in, they are more relaxed As far as Mya it seems like she keeps doing the behavior of pinning over and over to assert her dominance, after about two times of that I would verbally step in- not acceptable form of play for you. If she doesn't listen be prepared to be following her around the yard and get in a routine where she knows enough is enough. Once you have that TRUST between you and your dog I'd hold off. As far as luka- was this puppy playin with Knox? Because when we first got dexter he was "hers" and no other dog could play with him only her and she would nudge bump and mouth growl our neighbor dogs when they would lay with him- ( always wants attention!) maybe Luis was letting he puppy know hey he's mine? Best of luck-

Yes! The puppy was playing with Knox and that's when Luka got a little too rough. It's like he was like hey he's my friend not yours and you can't play with him! When I first got Luka he was around a Boston terrier for months so he has always been good with any size dog. When we got Knox things changed a bit. He has always been very careful with Knox but now that Knox is 30 lbs he gets a little rough sometimes. I don't know if I'm just overreacting and it's normal play but every once and awhile I do step in. I do agree that Knox needs better manners. I've been taking him to the dog park to socialize him and he's come a long way. I've also noticed they tend to get too rough with each other if bones are involved. They both will have one but all of a sudden Knox decides he wants Lukas and Luka is not down for that. That is when both bones are taken away. If they can't behave then no one gets one. I do feel guilty though because Luka technically isn't doing anything wrong. If you tried to take my treat I probably wouldn't just let you either. I'm not sure how to correct that any other way. My point is Luka has gotten too rough with another dog ONE time. I understand that one time is all it takes and that's why I'm posting. Our friends bring dogs over all the time and he's just happy go lucky and no issues. But this one particular time he went after the puppy probably 3 times when Knox was playing with him so I leashed him and we left. The owner of the puppy was like they're fine they're just playing but honestly I know my dog and he just doesn't play like that.

[LittleLuka]

I'm just picking up on the general tone of the thread, so no it's not directed specifically at you. I'm not certain what you mean by it's unfair to have him leashed all the time. I didn't mean to have him leashed with you holding the leash in your hands the entire time. You can let it drag...it's just there so that you have a means of intervening without putting yourself between two dogs that are getting too rough...a bite regardless of whether it was on accident or purpose can likely hurt a great deal and safety for you is important. If you're not safe you can't keep your dogs safe. With the dogs in your home if they're responding to verbal cues then continue to do that. If you have to physically separate them, that's a problem. It's good that he's not having the issue all the time. You'd be tearing your hair out likely if he was. He doesn't have to do it all the time for you to identify and correct the behavior and to give praise and positive reinforcement when he is behaving appropriately. That's how any behavior is changed...the reward for doing what you'd like him to do is better than the immediate pay-off for doing what feels good just then. If the issue is with both dogs, then it really needs to be addressed with both dogs every time it happens.

Luka has what I like to call selective hearing. He does listen to me as opposed to my OH but that's simply because I've put in more training with him. He will chill out but Knox keeps on and so yes I do have to separate them. I'm talking maybe once a month tops to give you a better insight. My issue is that I don't understand how a dog like Luka is fine with all dogs and then Sunday he acts different. I didn't understand what you meant about leasing him. That sounds more reasonable and I will def consider trying that. I don't mean to sound defensive sometimes it's just frustrating because I can't explain exactly what I mean online and no one really knows my dog but me. I appreciate your advice!

[Applebear]

Do you want to risk your best friends accidentally biting you when you try to intervene...or pick up a leash off he ground and pull the dog out of the situation while giving a verbal correction?  I'm not keen on the idea of being bitten personally. 

 

With your friend...I would talk to her about the behavior blatently.  Explain that you recognize that it's not something that should be reinforced by her dog or your dog, and ask that she leave a leash on just again so that intervening doesn't result in stitches or even a bandaid.  I can't stress enough that if the people aren't safe and not in pain they can't do much to help the dogs. 

 

Corrections...if she's who you're going to be working with on this then yes the both of you need to be on the same page!!!!  I really am so lucky that I have Bonnie and the Door County Sled Dogs to help me with Eponine's social retardedness.

 

In other words, just easier to have a leash on him.

 

I have tried to talk to friend about the behavior, but we really aren't coming to the same page...it's become more 'your dog is the one being too rough.' Part of it is she worries she will damage her dogs if she gets too firm with them, so often the solution is to just let me play the bully who is telling my dog No and sit...all the while her dog is interfering with the correction. We are both neglecting the fact it's not about which dog is causing pain, but about what behavior is being allowed period [reinforced like you said]. I think we are going to have to revisit the subject again...we BOTH want our dogs to be play buddies, so we BOTH need to do our share or not do it at all.

 

I do still worry when I bring a pup home, but I'm starting to think it's more doable than I'm being made to feel. It may not be easy, but impossible...maybe not. Ro lives with a 8 pound dog and has yet to pick that dog up by the neck...if he can get it through his thick skull that's not ok, why can he not do the same with other pack members with my guidance? 

 

Thank you for your time and advice...and thanks midnight for letting me vent it out on this thread too.

[Bec]

Personally I don't like dog parks and would never use them - IMO if you have a dog that behaves inappropriately and isn't under effective control the dog park is not the place for them.

My Sibe was attacked as a pup by other dogs who would grab him around the neck and shake him and it ruined him FOR LIFE. The effects of those attacks could never be truly undone. He became fear aggressive as a result and would attack other dogs and pups by grabbing them by the neck and shaking them as was done to him. Had the owners of the dogs that attacked him been more responsible none of that would ever have happened to him.

"Huskies play rough" is something that comes up a lot on this forum and others a lot and while its not untrue, I think it can be used to play down inappropriate Behaviour. If you want to take your dog to places like dog parks, you need to have a dog that understands how to behave appropriately with other dogs. End of story. Don't wait until your dog does the wrong thing, learn to read the signs that your dog is becoming over aroused and prevent and interrupt bad Behaviour before it occurs.

Not having a go at anyone but trying to give a different perspective. If you know your dog isn't totally reliable when it comes to behaving appropriately don't put them in a situation where their Behaviour will escalate.