mikeeholder Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hi. I think my husky has a zinc defficency but it seem very difficult to test. I haven't yet ruled out a food allergy. He is on zinc supplements but they appear to have little or no effect, how long could it take for them to start working? I have also changed his food to grain free for sensitive skin. The vet has given him antibiotic for the patches on his head (ceporex) and has done skin samples but nothing was found. He has been scratching and making sore, scabby patches on his head, muzzle, bottom of his ears and previously round his eyes. Any help or advise would be greatly appreciated. If he doesn't stop scratching or his head doesn't clear up the vet said she would have to shave his head!! I'm not convinced!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Povodny Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Liza jones may be able to help you, indi was suspected of the same not long ago I think. As for shaving, Safi had to have her belly shaved entirely for ultrasound. It only grew back when she next blew her coat so she was basically bald as a coot for about 8months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Jones Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hi it's very hard to see anything on that pic. Indi my 3 year old has just been diagnosed 3 weeks ago with ZRD see pics below. It started with a crusting around her eyes and quickly spread to patches across her muzzle and lips and in her ears. She had a skin biopsy at the vets and they diagnosed ZRD. She also has been on supplements for 3 weeks and I've just changed over her diet to CSJ Hike On which had a very high level of zinc in after a recommend from someone who has 2 with ZRD. As of yet there is no improvement!! So maybe it takes a while for the supplements to work!! Some pics of Indi's legions ( As you can see its very crusty and the skin can be very red or appears black! They loose the hair in that spot also Hope this helps and hope your boys ok soon such a worry when they are not well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Jones Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Also extremely itchy and poor indi has been wearing the cone of shame now for around 5 weeks poor thing!!! She now thinks its part of her and feels naked when its not on!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Povodny Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hi it's very hard to see anything on that pic. Indi my 3 year old has just been diagnosed 3 weeks ago with ZRD see pics below. It started with a crusting around her eyes and quickly spread to patches across her muzzle and lips and in her ears. She had a skin biopsy at the vets and they diagnosed ZRD. She also has been on supplements for 3 weeks and I've just changed over her diet to CSJ Hike On which had a very high level of zinc in after a recommend from someone who has 2 with ZRD. As of yet there is no improvement!! So maybe it takes a while for the supplements to work!! Some pics of Indi's legions ( ImageUploadedByTapatalk1361609885.340991.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1361609905.807114.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1361609935.174004.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1361609960.690104.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1361609999.873772.jpg As you can see its very crusty and the skin can be very red or appears black! They loose the hair in that spot also Hope this helps and hope your boys ok soon such a worry when they are not well Oh Liz, poor poor Indi, it looks so sore. Hope she starts showing improvement soon. Just as you start to despair, they seem to turn a corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted February 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hi liz. Thanks for the speedy response. Your poor indi, that looks very aggressive and uncomfortable. Bandits has developed quite quickly within 2 weeks he has had a 1cm sore on the left of his head develop into the entire top of his head, nose and ears. He's constantly scratching at it which makes it bleed and scab. May I ask what type of zinc supplement you are using including dosage. How quickly did this spread on indi? Sorry bout the pic it's the best I have at the moment. I'll get some better ones later. Every day I wake up, he's been scratching at it and its almost doubled in size. Has this affected indi in any other ways; lethargic, feeding, etc? Sorry for the interrogation but someone who has experience first had is a lot more useful than a text book example that the vets refer to! Is your food rich in vitamin A? I read this is what help the absorption of zinc. Your help is much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Jones Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hi it might be useful to put the cone of shame on him so he can't scratch it if I leave it off indi at the moment she scratches that much she draws blood and makes it worse! Indi is on Zinacutin tabs one per day zinc level 40mg with added vitamins including vitamin A. The CSJ has two types of zinc and is 400mg/1kg but she's only just been on this since Wednesday!! Also I've been adding salmon oil and giving her cooked liver . I'm willing to try anything at the moment!! She still seems to be developing new legions as well but vet says to give her time! Our vet has had experience with this before so was quite knowledgeable and sent her for tests quite quickly. She started with a crusty eye and within a weekend it had spread to her nose lip and one ear. She now has legions in both ears, back, underneath and new legion on her nose! Still extremely itchy!! Any questions just ask not a problem but I'm no expert as indi only just developed it so relatively new to ZRD !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Jones Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 She's been reluctant to run but apart from that no lethargy or lose of appetite . The lack of running could just be indi being indi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted February 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 A couple of better pictures of the more recent dry areas. After upping his dosage of zinc suppliments and not feeding him them with dinner he seems a lot better. He is also now on sensative salmon and potato dry food which is rich in vit A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nayeli.Bella Posted March 7, 2013 Report Share Posted March 7, 2013 Hi everyone! I'm so happy to have found this forum. I'm sorry to see that your dogs are going through this too - I am experiencing the same with my 2 year old female Nayeli. She has the lesions around both eyes, I can see the start of another on her lip and also her vulva. I started her on Zinc Gluconate Sunday Feb 3rd, 30mgs a day - I think she can stand to take a higher dose as she's 70lbs - but I'm worried about giving her too much. I may increase after a week. At the initial vets visit they did a scrape test to rule out mange, but did find bacteria present (come to find out this is common w/ ZRD) they started her on antibiotics to help fight the bacteria and also a Neosporin eye ointment to heal the wounds. 2 weeks later the lesions got worse - and in the mean time I conducted my own research and learned about ZRD and Zinc deficiency - My gut tells me this is what it is. At her follow up appointment this Tues, our vets told us that they have never heard of ZRD and of course ruled it out, as it is a "very rare" condition - so why would she have it? They wanted to diagnose ringworm, and I opposed - her German Shepherd brother has not itched/scratched once, shows no sign of ringworm or any lesions and they wrestle and rub up against each other all day long - My husband and I are free of any signs also! We have a follow up with the vet in 2 weeks. I'm really hoping that I can help my little girl more naturally - I don't want to be told or encouraged to pump drugs into my dog when I believe they'll cause other damage and not correct her situation. Personality, appetite, and energy levels are all completely normal - you wouldn't think anything was wrong despite her sore looking face. Here are her pictures - what do you think?... given the cases with your pups? 1st week - 2nd week, the other eye worsened - Today - This is the first eye as of today, for the most part it looks better, it's not so inflamed and her fur is starting to grow back. Although now I can see the top of her eye starting to flare up. The vets printed me out a page on ZRD from a resource book they had, it has good information - I am happy to scan it in and share it with you, if you like? I hope that you all notice an improvement really soon for Indi, Bandit and Safi! - Jo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 Hi everyone! I'm so happy to have found this forum. I'm sorry to see that your dogs are going through this too - I am experiencing the same with my 2 year old female Nayeli. She has the lesions around both eyes, I can see the start of another on her lip and also her vulva. I started her on Zinc Gluconate Sunday Feb 3rd, 30mgs a day - I think she can stand to take a higher dose as she's 70lbs - but I'm worried about giving her too much. I may increase after a week. At the initial vets visit they did a scrape test to rule out mange, but did find bacteria present (come to find out this is common w/ ZRD) they started her on antibiotics to help fight the bacteria and also a Neosporin eye ointment to heal the wounds. 2 weeks later the lesions got worse - and in the mean time I conducted my own research and learned about ZRD and Zinc deficiency - My gut tells me this is what it is. At her follow up appointment this Tues, our vets told us that they have never heard of ZRD and of course ruled it out, as it is a "very rare" condition - so why would she have it? They wanted to diagnose ringworm, and I opposed - her German Shepherd brother has not itched/scratched once, shows no sign of ringworm or any lesions and they wrestle and rub up against each other all day long - My husband and I are free of any signs also! We have a follow up with the vet in 2 weeks. I'm really hoping that I can help my little girl more naturally - I don't want to be told or encouraged to pump drugs into my dog when I believe they'll cause other damage and not correct her situation. Personality, appetite, and energy levels are all completely normal - you wouldn't think anything was wrong despite her sore looking face. Here are her pictures - what do you think?... given the cases with your pups? 1st week - image.jpeg 2nd week, the other eye worsened - image2.jpeg Today - image5.jpeg This is the first eye as of today, for the most part it looks better, it's not so inflamed and her fur is starting to grow back. Although now I can see the top of her eye starting to flare up. image6.jpeg The vets printed me out a page on ZRD from a resource book they had, it has good information - I am happy to scan it in and share it with you, if you like? I hope that you all notice an improvement really soon for Indi, Bandit and Safi! - Jo The vets tried to do ringworm tests etc for bandit but i turned them down for similar reasons. I am little confused myself, I have done alot of reading on ZRD and am 99% sure that this is bandits problem. However the vet has not ruled it out but seems to think that ZRD is a conditon that is not caused by a lack of Zinc but a form of dermitis that is helped by zinc but triggered by something else I.e. food allergy. This is the first I have heard of this myself and am unsure how legit this statement is but it make sense being Zinc Resposnsive Dermatitis. Bandit is on antibiotics at the moment as he has pyoderma on his head as a result of scratching and breaking the skin. He is also on a food trial to try and determin if he has any allergies which could cause the scabbing. If your vet has ruled this out because they have never heard of it i would suggest finding another vet. The first vet I went to refused to recognise ZRD and diagnosed him with a Entropion (turned in eyelid) and wanted to operate!! This is a very rare conditon in most dog breeds however it is very common in all northern breed: mals, sibes etc. Try and find a vet who has experience with northern breed, preferably one who owns one, or show your vet all the info you have. The next step for me is to send him to a dog dermatologist, which will be very pricy!! From your pictures I would say they are almost identical to the wounds on bandits face and ears, however I still have no formal diagnosis. Are you supplimenting with zinc tablets or powder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 better picture of his eye, he now has the same on the top of both eyes and both sides of his nose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 "I started her on Zinc Gluconate Sunday Feb 3rd, 30mgs a day - I think she can stand to take a higher dose as she's 70lbs - but I'm worried about giving her too much" - Sorry didn't see this before i mentioned supplements! 50mg is recommended dosage for Bandit who is 28.8 kgs which is abouts 64lbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keeonah Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 Wow it sounds like you have a few problems there Mike but you seem to be doing things right. I never take the opinion of one person though. I did this before and found out that I was given the wrong information but I realised to late. I would get a second opinion from another vet and I would find out if this vet is coversant with this sort of problem before going to them. Gary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 this is the patch from his nose that popped up two days ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nayeli.Bella Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 The vets tried to do ringworm tests etc for bandit but i turned them down for similar reasons. I am little confused myself, I have done alot of reading on ZRD and am 99% sure that this is bandits problem. However the vet has not ruled it out but seems to think that ZRD is a conditon that is not caused by a lack of Zinc but a form of dermitis that is helped by zinc but triggered by something else I.e. food allergy. This is the first I have heard of this myself and am unsure how legit this statement is but it make sense being Zinc Resposnsive Dermatitis. Bandit is on antibiotics at the moment as he has pyoderma on his head as a result of scratching and breaking the skin. He is also on a food trial to try and determin if he has any allergies which could cause the scabbing. If your vet has ruled this out because they have never heard of it i would suggest finding another vet. The first vet I went to refused to recognise ZRD and diagnosed him with a Entropion (turned in eyelid) and wanted to operate!! This is a very rare conditon in most dog breeds however it is very common in all northern breed: mals, sibes etc. Try and find a vet who has experience with northern breed, preferably one who owns one, or show your vet all the info you have. The next step for me is to send him to a dog dermatologist, which will be very pricy!! From your pictures I would say they are almost identical to the wounds on bandits face and ears, however I still have no formal diagnosis. Are you supplimenting with zinc tablets or powder? Thank you for your reply! I feel that vets try to make things more complicated a lot of the time! I will take your advice and seek out a vet with Husky experience! We have a referral for a Dog Derm too - I don't want to think of how expensive that will be just yet!! Going to continue with the Zinc, I will increase a little and see what happens. Did you incorporate a Vit A supplement or just an 'A' rich food? I want to add that to her routine to help with the absorption. I'm just trying to find the safe dosage. It's so disheartening when it looks like it's clearing up and then appears somewhere else! I've read that Vitamin E gel vitamins are great to pierce and apply to the sores. Obviously being careful of the eye. I'm going to try that this weekend. I'll let you know if it gives any relief. Bandit is very handsome, I like his elvis sideburns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 he is just about to start on a new food rich in two types of zinc and vitamin A called "hike on". it was recommened by an other forum member (Liz Jones) in this topic salmon oil is good or any type of oily fish have heard some people feed sardines. Have also heard not to give them zinc sups with there meal as it just gets absobed by the calcium in the food, I suppliment about midday between meals. Just a case of trial and error unfortunatly, its very frustrating I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nayeli.Bella Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 Thank you - I appreciate you sharing your findings with me! Please update this page with how Bandit is doing!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2013 new one overnight!! its getting much worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chula Posted March 9, 2013 Report Share Posted March 9, 2013 Poor baby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeeholder Posted March 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2013 Spoke to a chap today who races husky's on the island (been looking for them for a while and just bumped into a young lad who races with them). He has 11 husky's and has a few with zinc responsive dermatitis which comes and goes periodically, he gives them raw liver to combat it with no suppliment. All his dogs are on a BARF diet as well. Anyway, he had a look at bandit and didn't seem to think his was ZRD, or look like anything he had seen . In his dogs it is just a red area of skin around the mouth and eyes, no lesions or the black scabby areas that bandit and the other dogs on here have. He isn't a vet obviously but he has recommended a vet which he uses, so will look into that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylepeo Posted March 9, 2013 Report Share Posted March 9, 2013 i too have the same problem with my boy jake vet said could not see any problem and gave him antibiotics for 10 days he has finished them and still no better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nayeli.Bella Posted March 11, 2013 Report Share Posted March 11, 2013 Poor boy! His seem to be spreading more than Nayeli's - her lesions are staying around the eyes really, they look like they are drying up a little. Is he still scratching a lot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nayeli.Bella Posted March 11, 2013 Report Share Posted March 11, 2013 Mike definitely check out that vet referral! Let us know what they say. It's interesting that your new contact didn't seem to recognize Bandit's sores as ZRD. i too have the same problem with my boy jake vet said could not see any problem and gave him antibiotics for 10 days he has finished them and still no better we tried antibiotics too - no improvement. Have you been back to the vet since? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylepeo Posted March 11, 2013 Report Share Posted March 11, 2013 yeah sometime catch him scratching sudocrem works well tho i changed food a couple month back reading on the new food it has more zinc in than the old and he never had this problem for the 1st 9 months of having him i did read that too much zinc is the same as not enough as huskys have a problem trying to digest it so the body will react to it as if it was not enough so im going to try him back on his old food see what i get then if nothing changes i will then look at giving him a zinc supplement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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